Tuesday, January 27, 2004
It's not over until it's over. Here are a few late musings, added after permission to post caught up with me on the airplane returning from Fort Lauderdale.
Model Trading Partner Project -- The Electronic Commerce Subcommittee's project to update the 1990 Model Trading Partner Agreement made concrete progress this weekend. We reviewed a new draft; plan to recirculate it with further revisions next month; and set an ambitious schedule for completion.
IP Subcommittee open source project -- There was a fruitful Intellectual Property Subcommittee work session Saturday afternoon on Open Source licenses. They have launched a great program for reviewing existing variations on open source and free licenses, and working towards a compare-and-contrast analysis.
Not Eating Our Dog Food Yet? -- Does anybody find it odd that valid execution of the annual committee dinner transaction (see the entry "Touch My Cork" below) forced Rich Keck to mail a physical cork to Florida? Shouldn't there be an equally enforceable electronic reification of the dang cork? Did we miss something in the drafting of UETA sec. 16?
Maybe the intangible version only works in Minnesota; a theory whose test will have to wait for the inevitable eventual Minnesota Winter Working Meeting. For now, see you in April in Seattle.
Model Trading Partner Project -- The Electronic Commerce Subcommittee's project to update the 1990 Model Trading Partner Agreement made concrete progress this weekend. We reviewed a new draft; plan to recirculate it with further revisions next month; and set an ambitious schedule for completion.
- Data will be posted to the subcommittee's ABA mailing list (BL-ECOMMERCE) and the Cyberspace committee's lawhub site, as well as to those who attended our drafting meetings in San Francisco.
- Schedule: (1) Revised version of model text available in mid-February, (2) Review & finalize the model text, and first airing of draft commentary, in the April Business Law Section Spring Meeting), (3) finalize in August at the ABA Annual Meeting.
IP Subcommittee open source project -- There was a fruitful Intellectual Property Subcommittee work session Saturday afternoon on Open Source licenses. They have launched a great program for reviewing existing variations on open source and free licenses, and working towards a compare-and-contrast analysis.
Not Eating Our Dog Food Yet? -- Does anybody find it odd that valid execution of the annual committee dinner transaction (see the entry "Touch My Cork" below) forced Rich Keck to mail a physical cork to Florida? Shouldn't there be an equally enforceable electronic reification of the dang cork? Did we miss something in the drafting of UETA sec. 16?
Maybe the intangible version only works in Minnesota; a theory whose test will have to wait for the inevitable eventual Minnesota Winter Working Meeting. For now, see you in April in Seattle.
Monday, January 26, 2004
It's Over
We forgot to tell you. It's over. The meeting wrapped up at about 3 on Satuday. The few remaining stragglers had dinner at Charley's Crab on the Intercoastal waterway. Most departed Sunday morning. This blog will stay up indefinitely. We'll probably eventually move the text (if not the format) over to the Law Hub for easier reference by the group.
Thanks to all who participated in the meetings.
We forgot to tell you. It's over. The meeting wrapped up at about 3 on Satuday. The few remaining stragglers had dinner at Charley's Crab on the Intercoastal waterway. Most departed Sunday morning. This blog will stay up indefinitely. We'll probably eventually move the text (if not the format) over to the Law Hub for easier reference by the group.
Thanks to all who participated in the meetings.
GROUP PHOTO
For those of you who missed it (and even for those who were there) here's the group photo from this year's Winter Working Meeting. We should take pictures every year.
For those of you who missed it (and even for those who were there) here's the group photo from this year's Winter Working Meeting. We should take pictures every year.
Saturday, January 24, 2004
Next Year Anyone?
The voting, controversy, and general battle over where to go next winter has already begun. Warm? Not warm? FLA? CA? DC? The ever-present choice of Minneapolis, in its annual ritual, has been floated and summarily rejected (wimps!). Vince will continue to work it through.
The voting, controversy, and general battle over where to go next winter has already begun. Warm? Not warm? FLA? CA? DC? The ever-present choice of Minneapolis, in its annual ritual, has been floated and summarily rejected (wimps!). Vince will continue to work it through.
** Rides Leave at 6pm for Charley's Crab House **
Meet at 6pm in front of the hotel for a ride to Charley's. If you have a car and can drive, please be out front a few minutes before 6pm.
Meet at 6pm in front of the hotel for a ride to Charley's. If you have a car and can drive, please be out front a few minutes before 6pm.
NEWS OF POSSIBLE INTEREST
[From Slashdot}
"The scientists working on the Digital Preservation Program at the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) has released an excellent 50 page guide on care and handling of CDs and DVDs for long term storage. It talks about the effects of light, moisture, radiation, scratches, marking, adhesive labels, and even playback on the discs. For those slashdotters who is not familiar with the physical made up of these optical discs, there is a very nice chapter explaining all the background. And if you only want to know how to care for your precious data, there is a one page summary. And yes, they agreed that glued-on labels are harmful."
[From Slashdot}
"The scientists working on the Digital Preservation Program at the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) has released an excellent 50 page guide on care and handling of CDs and DVDs for long term storage. It talks about the effects of light, moisture, radiation, scratches, marking, adhesive labels, and even playback on the discs. For those slashdotters who is not familiar with the physical made up of these optical discs, there is a very nice chapter explaining all the background. And if you only want to know how to care for your precious data, there is a one page summary. And yes, they agreed that glued-on labels are harmful."
DINNER TONIGHT AT CHARLEY'S CRAB HOUSE
Charley's comes highly recommended by those with a good palate. Join us tonight at 6:30 for Dinner at Charley's. Directions from the hotel are here. [NOTE: MAPBLAST did not find the easiest route, but this can get you there.]
Meet at 6pm in front of the hotel for a ride.
Charley's comes highly recommended by those with a good palate. Join us tonight at 6:30 for Dinner at Charley's. Directions from the hotel are here. [NOTE: MAPBLAST did not find the easiest route, but this can get you there.]
Meet at 6pm in front of the hotel for a ride.
CAN SPAM PROGRAM
Work is underway on a program for the Annual Meeting on the subject of how the CAN SPAM Act affects law firm newsletters and marketing. The program will hopefully qualify for ethics credit.
Work is underway on a program for the Annual Meeting on the subject of how the CAN SPAM Act affects law firm newsletters and marketing. The program will hopefully qualify for ethics credit.
LawHub Training! -- Vince is giving one-on-one tutorials on using the Cyberspace Committee LawHub in front of the main classroom. The LawHub resides at http://lawplace.metadot.com -- publicly available materials there include ABA past program materials, and the MIRLN e-newsletter. Registered users have access to threaded-discussion forums and subcommittee materials (including working drafts on projects such as VoIP, SPAM, and browse-wrap licensing practices). If you want to become a registered user, visit the site and click on "Register" -- OR, stop by and sign up with Vince.
SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM
The impact of SPAM on all of our projects was clearly evident at the meeting. The folks working on the international electronic contract convention spent a great deal of time discussing the impact of spam (and measure to prevent it) on several legal issues, including
- the concept of sent and received
- the concept of information system
- under the control of a party
- the need for confirmatory messages
CAIT is working on a program for the Annual Meeting on the CAN SPAM Act, including whether and to what extent the Act will impact law firms that send materials to clients. Is a law firm newsletter a commercial message?
Several projects were kicked off to deal with these issues.
The impact of SPAM on all of our projects was clearly evident at the meeting. The folks working on the international electronic contract convention spent a great deal of time discussing the impact of spam (and measure to prevent it) on several legal issues, including
- the concept of sent and received
- the concept of information system
- under the control of a party
- the need for confirmatory messages
CAIT is working on a program for the Annual Meeting on the CAN SPAM Act, including whether and to what extent the Act will impact law firms that send materials to clients. Is a law firm newsletter a commercial message?
Several projects were kicked off to deal with these issues.
Lenny's Karoake
I wasn't there, but I understand pictures were taken of Lenny at the hotel bar last night with his laptop and rather large speakers. He apparently kept playing show tunes and forcing others to guess the song titles. Vince reportedly has pictures. We'll find them later.
I wasn't there, but I understand pictures were taken of Lenny at the hotel bar last night with his laptop and rather large speakers. He apparently kept playing show tunes and forcing others to guess the song titles. Vince reportedly has pictures. We'll find them later.
CAFE ARMADILLO
Dinner last night was at a local 4 star restaurant near the NSU Law School called Cafe Armadillo. The dinner was fine. It was made more exciting by the Mercedes that caught fire in the parking lot, the waiter who served us wine we hadn't paid for, and the toasts by Candace Jones and Chris Kunz.
Someday This Stuff....
Chris regaled everyone with a summary of the annual Winter Working Meeting story usually recounted by David Whitaker (who is MIA). Chris uttered the memorable phrase "Someday this EDI shit is going to mean something." [NOTE: She and Vince also explained the malleable nature of the story. Amy Boss, David Whitaker, Jeffrey Ritter, and others all have varying memories of when it was said and where and what the exact words were. Nevertheless, it's good history.]
Touch My Cork
Candace Jones then passed out corks fed ex'd to her by Richard Keck. She recounted the story of how one of the first Cyberspace groups was focused on the issue of "manifestation of assent" which has now found its way into UETA and ESIGN. Here's the short version: Richard Keck wanted to demonstrate how relatively ambiguous actions could (but should not) be construed as demonstrating assent to contract. Richard turned to a rather attractive woman sitting next to him at the bar, handed her a cork, and asked her to "touch my cork." She promptly did so, with a rather puzzled look on her face. Richard then turned to the rest of the group and explained that the act of touching his cork was rather ambiguous but could nevertheless have been misconstrued as a manifestation of assent to something.
If you're confused, you'll just have to ask someone who was there, such as Candace, Richard, or some of the others from the first generation of Cyberspace.
Dinner last night was at a local 4 star restaurant near the NSU Law School called Cafe Armadillo. The dinner was fine. It was made more exciting by the Mercedes that caught fire in the parking lot, the waiter who served us wine we hadn't paid for, and the toasts by Candace Jones and Chris Kunz.
Someday This Stuff....
Chris regaled everyone with a summary of the annual Winter Working Meeting story usually recounted by David Whitaker (who is MIA). Chris uttered the memorable phrase "Someday this EDI shit is going to mean something." [NOTE: She and Vince also explained the malleable nature of the story. Amy Boss, David Whitaker, Jeffrey Ritter, and others all have varying memories of when it was said and where and what the exact words were. Nevertheless, it's good history.]
Touch My Cork
Candace Jones then passed out corks fed ex'd to her by Richard Keck. She recounted the story of how one of the first Cyberspace groups was focused on the issue of "manifestation of assent" which has now found its way into UETA and ESIGN. Here's the short version: Richard Keck wanted to demonstrate how relatively ambiguous actions could (but should not) be construed as demonstrating assent to contract. Richard turned to a rather attractive woman sitting next to him at the bar, handed her a cork, and asked her to "touch my cork." She promptly did so, with a rather puzzled look on her face. Richard then turned to the rest of the group and explained that the act of touching his cork was rather ambiguous but could nevertheless have been misconstrued as a manifestation of assent to something.
If you're confused, you'll just have to ask someone who was there, such as Candace, Richard, or some of the others from the first generation of Cyberspace.
Dinner Was a Blast
Literally. We showed up at the restaurant -- the Armadillo Cafe -- at about 7:30. As many of us were walking up to the front door, a car suddenly caught fire and had flames licking up about 5-6 feet. I first thought it was just some spectacular thing for the tourists to watch, but realized something was amiss when I saw the valet running at top speed and with terror in his eyes. Later in the restaurant, the manager was walking around, quietly asking the patrons if anybody owned a black Mercedes (!).
The evening was wonderful. The food was great -- with barely a faint aura of burned car in there. Christina Kunz took over the reins from Dave Whitaker to give the traditional WWM toast (which cannot be repeated in a public forum, and besides, you have to come to the next meeting if you want to know what it is!). Candace Jones told the cork story to a rousing applause.
As always, the WWM dinner is the best of the year for our group, and to all who joined us -- Thank You!
Literally. We showed up at the restaurant -- the Armadillo Cafe -- at about 7:30. As many of us were walking up to the front door, a car suddenly caught fire and had flames licking up about 5-6 feet. I first thought it was just some spectacular thing for the tourists to watch, but realized something was amiss when I saw the valet running at top speed and with terror in his eyes. Later in the restaurant, the manager was walking around, quietly asking the patrons if anybody owned a black Mercedes (!).
The evening was wonderful. The food was great -- with barely a faint aura of burned car in there. Christina Kunz took over the reins from Dave Whitaker to give the traditional WWM toast (which cannot be repeated in a public forum, and besides, you have to come to the next meeting if you want to know what it is!). Candace Jones told the cork story to a rousing applause.
As always, the WWM dinner is the best of the year for our group, and to all who joined us -- Thank You!
Friday, January 23, 2004
NEWS
Microsoft has applied for patents that could prevent competing applications from processing documents created with the latest version of the software giant's Office program. Read More at CNET.
Microsoft has applied for patents that could prevent competing applications from processing documents created with the latest version of the software giant's Office program. Read More at CNET.
My, Aren't We Timely, Relevant, and Meaningful
Those who may think our efforts are not relevant, should review this article that was published in the NY Times this week entitled The Electronic Verification is in the Mail. The U.S. Post Office is offering an electronic verification service with a private third party service provider.
The Electronic Contracting Working Group is addressing these very issues. Read more below.
Those who may think our efforts are not relevant, should review this article that was published in the NY Times this week entitled The Electronic Verification is in the Mail. The U.S. Post Office is offering an electronic verification service with a private third party service provider.
The Electronic Contracting Working Group is addressing these very issues. Read more below.
CAIT Saturday Meetings Rescheduled
Instead of the published schedule for CAIT meetings, we will be going as follows (all in the large lecture room):
8:30 - 10:30: M&A Technology Due Diligence Project
10:30 - 12:00 SPAM project followup (
12:00 - 1:00 Lunch
1:00 - 2:15 E Authentication
2:15 - 3:00 CAIT Wrapup
CAIT Group Leaders -- Remember that we need to get your reports to Don and/or Michael during or before that wrapup. Failure to do so will lead to us reporting that you've collapsed into a pile of goo and should be written off. Thank you for your support.
Instead of the published schedule for CAIT meetings, we will be going as follows (all in the large lecture room):
8:30 - 10:30: M&A Technology Due Diligence Project
10:30 - 12:00 SPAM project followup (
12:00 - 1:00 Lunch
1:00 - 2:15 E Authentication
2:15 - 3:00 CAIT Wrapup
CAIT Group Leaders -- Remember that we need to get your reports to Don and/or Michael during or before that wrapup. Failure to do so will lead to us reporting that you've collapsed into a pile of goo and should be written off. Thank you for your support.
Regulation Speeding Ahead of Reality?
The SPAM group is having the unusual problem of figuring out that regulators will actually be acting faster than we as a group can keep up with them. Is it not the other way around?
[EDITORIAL COMMENT] The spammers will move faster than all of us.
The SPAM group is having the unusual problem of figuring out that regulators will actually be acting faster than we as a group can keep up with them. Is it not the other way around?
[EDITORIAL COMMENT] The spammers will move faster than all of us.
**
Electronic Contracting Working Group
**
Reviewed the Provisions for a draft convention on electronic contracting from the United Nations Commission on International Trade Law.
Article 16. Error in electronic communications.
1. Worked towards a proposed change to how the issue of errors in electronic communications should be handled:
a. Is there a difference between "value" and "benefit" for purposes of deciding whether a party can void a contract they entered into.
b. Should the draft focus on natural persons to get away from the problem of system to system transactions?
c. Should there be a requirement that an error be material? As drafted, the draft could permit a party to void a contract because they made an error in their address.
d. The draft seems to focus on mistakes by a buyer, not a seller. This should be revised.
Article 10. Time and place of dispatch and receipt of data messages.
1. Should the concept of "information system" be revised? Does it work for records that are posted to a Web site for review by a person?
2. There are many different forms of communication that make this a problematic endeavor, including IM, text messages, SMS, P2P file exchange systems, email, web-based email, encrypted email messages, staged server processes, web-based chat systems. Does the "information system" concept have long-term viability?
3. What about an "electronic address?"
[and for those of you who think this is all not relevant, consider this article that was published in the NY Times this week entitled The Electronic Verification is in the Mail]
Electronic Contracting Working Group
**
Reviewed the Provisions for a draft convention on electronic contracting from the United Nations Commission on International Trade Law.
Article 16. Error in electronic communications.
1. Worked towards a proposed change to how the issue of errors in electronic communications should be handled:
a. Is there a difference between "value" and "benefit" for purposes of deciding whether a party can void a contract they entered into.
b. Should the draft focus on natural persons to get away from the problem of system to system transactions?
c. Should there be a requirement that an error be material? As drafted, the draft could permit a party to void a contract because they made an error in their address.
d. The draft seems to focus on mistakes by a buyer, not a seller. This should be revised.
Article 10. Time and place of dispatch and receipt of data messages.
1. Should the concept of "information system" be revised? Does it work for records that are posted to a Web site for review by a person?
2. There are many different forms of communication that make this a problematic endeavor, including IM, text messages, SMS, P2P file exchange systems, email, web-based email, encrypted email messages, staged server processes, web-based chat systems. Does the "information system" concept have long-term viability?
3. What about an "electronic address?"
[and for those of you who think this is all not relevant, consider this article that was published in the NY Times this week entitled The Electronic Verification is in the Mail]
Breaking News: Playboy v Netscape Has Settled
Word is out that the Playboy/Netscape keyed banner ad case has settled -- terms are not public. So, we are potentially stuck with the troubling aspects of the 9th Circuit's decision. The decision may turn out to be so fact-bound that it won't have impact on the rest of the world, but we shall see...
Word is out that the Playboy/Netscape keyed banner ad case has settled -- terms are not public. So, we are potentially stuck with the troubling aspects of the 9th Circuit's decision. The decision may turn out to be so fact-bound that it won't have impact on the rest of the world, but we shall see...
Su-Su-Sushi -- Times Have Changed
Word has it that the student cafeteria here at the Nova U Law School has a very good sushi bar. In my day (!), we were so happy when the cafeteria got spicy fries instead of the regular ones.
(Will you turn into a good lawyer if you didn't suffer during law school?)
Word has it that the student cafeteria here at the Nova U Law School has a very good sushi bar. In my day (!), we were so happy when the cafeteria got spicy fries instead of the regular ones.
(Will you turn into a good lawyer if you didn't suffer during law school?)
**
Cybersecurity Working Group
**
Topics of discussion
1. Standards
Are there standards that companies can look to for information security? Are standards appropriate? Would Best Practices, checklists, etc. be more helpful?
Standards are changing and evolving constantly.
2. Nomenclature
"Information Assurance" is a new term that is out there and is starting to get traction.
3. Compliance
What does it mean to be compliant with the regultaions? When is a company done?
4. Role of General Counsel
What role does the GC have?
Cybersecurity Working Group
**
Topics of discussion
1. Standards
Are there standards that companies can look to for information security? Are standards appropriate? Would Best Practices, checklists, etc. be more helpful?
Standards are changing and evolving constantly.
2. Nomenclature
"Information Assurance" is a new term that is out there and is starting to get traction.
3. Compliance
What does it mean to be compliant with the regultaions? When is a company done?
4. Role of General Counsel
What role does the GC have?
**
2004 ANNUAL MEETING IN ATLANTA
**
By the end of the meeting, Hank Judy wants to know what programs we plan to present at the meeting. If you have suggestions, please see Hank here.
2004 ANNUAL MEETING IN ATLANTA
**
By the end of the meeting, Hank Judy wants to know what programs we plan to present at the meeting. If you have suggestions, please see Hank here.
**
INTERNET JURISDICTION II
**
Survey Says: Michael Geist summarized the Internet Jurisdiction survey done with the International Chamber of Commerce. Three hundred organizations from 38 countries responded. There were 30+ responses from companies in China.
They are now sorting through the data to find useful, interesting relationships the data show.
INTERNET JURISDICTION II
**
Survey Says: Michael Geist summarized the Internet Jurisdiction survey done with the International Chamber of Commerce. Three hundred organizations from 38 countries responded. There were 30+ responses from companies in China.
They are now sorting through the data to find useful, interesting relationships the data show.
Space-Time Continuum Convergences (redux)
Here I was wondering how we'd respond to a recent client request concerning electronic gift cards, and I show up this morning and hear that one of the working groups will be kick-starting a project potentially on point!
This Committee continues to amaze me with its prescience...
Here I was wondering how we'd respond to a recent client request concerning electronic gift cards, and I show up this morning and hear that one of the working groups will be kick-starting a project potentially on point!
This Committee continues to amaze me with its prescience...
**
GOOD MEETING QUOTES
**
Quote found on tombstone:
"I was expecting this, just not so soon."
-- Marc Perl
GOOD MEETING QUOTES
**
Quote found on tombstone:
"I was expecting this, just not so soon."
-- Marc Perl
**
Paper-Free CLE?
**
Candace just reminded us that even as we work to produce the cutting edge programs on the latest technology law, that the most important thing we produce for the CLE programs is the biggest pile of paper that we can. (Don't forget that you can see the ABA's program materials online now at this place.)
Paper-Free CLE?
**
Candace just reminded us that even as we work to produce the cutting edge programs on the latest technology law, that the most important thing we produce for the CLE programs is the biggest pile of paper that we can. (Don't forget that you can see the ABA's program materials online now at this place.)
**
WIFI VOIP
**
Lenny just demonstrated his IP prowess by using a WIFI phone, plugged into his USB Port, to connect to his office VOIP network via the law school's WIFI network over his law firm's VPN to call my cell phone.
A bit more work than leaning over to talk to me, but it works quite well.
WIFI VOIP
**
Lenny just demonstrated his IP prowess by using a WIFI phone, plugged into his USB Port, to connect to his office VOIP network via the law school's WIFI network over his law firm's VPN to call my cell phone.
A bit more work than leaning over to talk to me, but it works quite well.
**
WIFI
**
First challenge met. We convinced them to disable the security features on their WIFI network, and we're all now online.
WIFI
**
First challenge met. We convinced them to disable the security features on their WIFI network, and we're all now online.
Welcome to the 2004 Winter Working Meeting in Fort Lauderdale, Florida
